Rebuttal to Bob Abbey

Thank you Willis Lamm! Please read here.

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16 Responses to “Rebuttal to Bob Abbey”

  1. LOUIE COCROFT Says:

    DISTRICT OFFICES
    Goosenest Ranger District
    37805 Highway 97
    Macdoel, CA 96058
    (530) 398-4391
    FAX (530) 398-5749
    TDD (530) 398-5744
    Klamath National Forest Supervisor’s Office
    1312 Fairlane Road
    Yreka, CA 96097-9549
    Phone: (530) 842-6131
    Email: klamathinfo@fs.fed.us
    this is thanks to THE MUSTANG’S PROJECT BLOG–this is where we can send comments for the McGAVIN PEAK ROUND-U[

  2. Marilyn Wargo Says:

    Wow, i had not seen this.. Good find, Louie. Thanks Tracie, Mar

  3. LOUIE COCROFT Says:

    HOW SHOULD WE COMMENT–SAME AS BEFORE?

  4. LOUIE COCROFT Says:

    THE RUBY PIPELINE–NO WONDER THE ROAM ACT ISN’T GETTING ANYWHERE IN THE COMMITTEE OF ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES!
    HOW DID THE BILL END UP IN THAT PARTICULAR COMMITTEE? AREN’T THEY CLEVER, THOUGGH

    THE RUBY PIPELINE–NO WONDER THE ROAM ACT ISN’T GETTING ANYWHERE IN THE COMMITTEE OF ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES. HOW DID THE BILL END UP IN THAT COMMITTEE?

  5. LOUIE COCROFT Says:

    DID IT AGAIN.

  6. jo bunny Says:

    was trolling the net again today…..found this…..wondered if any of you would like to comment & add your opinion…..

    http://jlpearson.wordpress.com/2009/11/05/cloud/

    • jo bunny Says:

      looks like ms/mr pearson took down the blog….it said 370,000 horses on the plains, blm does 4 roundups a year, checks out every home before allowing horses to be adopted, & that you can get a wild horse for ony $100….asked for opinions, & i ever so politely responded with mine…guess s/he didn’t like it!

  7. Michael J Ahles Says:

    Preserving Freedom
    We can’t fight city hall, the BLM, or the cattlemen of the west, but we can choose wisely what we eat.
    Boycotting beef will free the mustangs as equally as our land, America the land that was once free, or as equally as ourselves.
    Let Freedom Ring!!!

    =
    MJA

    • kimmy Says:

      lmao! most american beef is exported, have fun boycotting south american beef! you people fight so fiercly for a cause you only know half about!

  8. LOUIE COCROFT Says:

    JO BUNNY–I’M NOT SURE ABOUT THIS ONE. IS THERE ANY DANGER OF PICKING UP A VIRUS WHEN WE GO ONTO DIFFERENT SITES. I AM VERY SUSPICIOUS, AS YOU CAN TELL.

  9. Marilyn Wargo Says:

    I really want to address what Willis wrote.

    BLM does deserve this peaceful citizen uprising for the wild horses and Burros.We have a right to be angry. Yet, we need to use the anger and channel it so we may accomplish things together. I guess I could have put this under Community Organizers Needed” also. Have you been thinking about having a group of face to face people who can not only demonstrate but meet and talk and learn together? This is what we need.

    Last fall Makendra was telling us we needed to take the learning and discussion a step further and go out and do something with other people. Just think of the time you have spent on this great and worthy cause all ready. The next step is to come out and meet others and do more. You are ready now. Most of you can do this. Even I can and I am a loner and set in me old ways.

    Now that the protests are started, we do need people to do more. Please consider being a central person in your community and ask others to join you and then figure out what you want to do.

    The anger needs to transcend the pot shots and some of the name calling. They do deserve it and they need to listen to us. We have to give them concrete reasons for listening. I have recently used the Pryor Mountain Wild Mustang Center as an example to BLM and in comments to articles. There is history, structure, organization and purpose with ability and experience that is growing. If you have not read Tracie Thompson’s interview with Matt Dillon at the Pryor center, go to The Mustang Project blog at WordPress and read it and some of her reasons for her approach. It is enlightening.

    The Pryor Mountain Wild Mustang Center has bridged a gap and may

  10. Marilyn Wargo Says:

    be able to successfully outgrow the need for further BLM roundups and removals. This is something that needs to begin all over where there are still herds that remain and will need to be better managed in the future. Can we bridge that gap?

    This is and will remain one amazing challenge for all of us who are ‘in training at the Cloud blog and at RT’s. There are experience people who have been out front and need our support. This campaign may be far from over. If so, what is to stop us from becoming a Real Force of the Horse and attempting to organize with people who live in herd areas, some of whom have blogs and keep track of horses like Matt, but who have not got an organization behind them, but would benefit the horses to begin one.

    Just working on our local level and organizing, anywhere in the country will help us continue to grow and work for management change for the horses and burros. It will help us march on DC and be heard in the Spring. It will give you companions to go visit your representatives and discuss the wild horse and burro reality that we have been educating ourselves about so intensely for months.

    Please let us all try to go a step further for our wild ones. mar

  11. LOUIE COCROFT Says:

    MAR, I THINK WE DO–YOU KIND OF JUST START WHERE YOU ARE. I’M ALWAYS TRYING TO PUT FORTH THE HORSES’ AND BURROS’ SIDE OF THE STORY. IT SEEMS THAT PEOPLE ARE FOR, AGAINST, NOT INTERESTED OR JUST HAVEN’T BEEN AWARE AT ALL. THE THING THAT HELPS IS TO HAVE THE DATA AND FACTS TO BACK UP WHAT YOU SAY. IT IS AN ONGOING PROCESS. I FIND IT SO HELPFUL TO HAVE THE PEOPLE WHO ARE IN THE FIELD AND ON THE SITES REPORT BACK SO WE KNOW WHAT’S GOING ON. WHEN I SEE THE REACTION OF ABSOLUTE HORROR WHEN PEOPLE KNOW, THAT TELLS ME THAT WHAT WE ARE DOING MATTERS.

  12. Nora Morbeck Says:

    I’d like to address something — one of the points that Salazar and Abbey both discuss. Horse starvation.

    In the wild, animals starve to death. Happens all the time. It’s not pleasant. It’s not pretty. But that’s one of the ways that Nature balances herself. To say that we’re rounding these herds up for their own good to save them from starvation is convoluted, at best. We don’t round them up to save them from cougar predation. We don’t round them up because they might fatally injure themselves out on the range, or be the target of lightning strikes or die during foaling.

    The BLM and the DOI claim that wild horse advocates are overly sentimental, but we aren’t the ones rounding up herds to save them from Nature. It’s such a smoke screen. We should ask if they round up elk or deer to save them from starvation.

    Of course, elk and deer are hunted because, in some areas, Nature is so far out of balance that there isn’t much choice. However, out on the range, left to their own destinies, herds do tend to balance themselves better. Also, hunters don’t take out 80% of a herd of elk or deer.

    Along with environmental assessments and population counts, the BLM should be able to document how many horses and burros die of starvation every year. If it’s the tragic issue they say it is, they should have it well documented. Photos, logs, statistical data and so on.

    I’m tired of the starvation excuse. Wild herd advocates have plenty of evidence to document that these animals aren’t starving. It’s time the government either provides its own documentation to the contrary or stops using starvation as an excuse for round ups.

    • Marilyn Wargo Says:

      Right on, Nora. This is a the myth machine of BLM. And many people come here to start with that one particular worry in mind. Isn’t BLM saving the horses? No way. The numbers reduction is their game with HMLs vs AMLs and they make a lie fit another lie.

      If WE and local observers are the ones in the future to know the horses and who has died, been born to who and the real numbers, we can know more than BLM. Knowledge is power. It did not save all the horses in Pryor, but it may when a program is in place like Chincoteague. That was what Matt had referred to 2012; the new darting in the field with one year contraceptives of chosen mares. That can be our goal for as many accessible herds as we have. We need the info. Then we demand new management away from the roundup/removals. No more lies if we know the truth and we have the documentation and the photos. They have some of this of this info but not enough. Never enough for real accuracy. We must stop the impoundment of wild equids and replace this violent system with science and responsibility from people who will do the ground work for the horses; locally committed volunteers and advocates.

      Can we be the ones who bring the sanity back to the management of the wild horses? I certainly hope so. How can we do this? We must work together and figure it out. If this were to happen, then in the long run, Craig’s vision of Natural Design can be allowed to occur. Let’s get to know these horses this year. Let’s talk to the people who have been monitoring herds and begin a National Wild Horse Data Base. BLM hates for us to name the horses but we nned to keep doing it and document all we can find, every year, all over. mar

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